tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post3564430693656876457..comments2024-03-29T08:01:51.705+00:00Comments on The Pub Curmudgeon: Then they came for the pub drinkersCurmudgeonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02558747878308766840noreply@blogger.comBlogger25125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-10446279427503559632012-12-22T15:31:00.909+00:002012-12-22T15:31:00.909+00:00Martin, I get the impression Newcastle is more lik...Martin, I get the impression Newcastle is more like Edinburgh or Glasgow in its drinking culture than Leeds or Manchester. Let alone Stockport.Curmudgeonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02558747878308766840noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-32437409486290321982012-12-20T23:05:20.440+00:002012-12-20T23:05:20.440+00:00I was in Newcastle last Saturday and genuinely ast...I was in Newcastle last Saturday and genuinely astonished at price of beer in their Beer Guide pubs (average £3.20-£3.60); beer was consistently good quality but pubs seemed to be very shiny and upmarket compared to Cambridge or the Norther Quarter. Very few drinkers pubs left in the centre.<br /><br />On the wider point, how would Council justify sale of any wine/spirits on that flaky basis ?Martin, Cambridgenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-39588667050305214172012-12-20T12:49:24.851+00:002012-12-20T12:49:24.851+00:00"If we stop smokers from blowing carcinogens ..."If we stop smokers from blowing carcinogens into other people's faces, tomorrow all forms of fun will be banned"<br /><br />pyO, that's actually what happened. Private clubs, staffed by volunteer members, where only consenting adults would have smoke blown into their faces were originally exempt from the Labour Party election manifesto proposals. Jonathan Bagleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17331501151709216753noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-74956839814527448982012-12-20T06:58:12.999+00:002012-12-20T06:58:12.999+00:00In Ipswich, Suffolk, the local Council and Plod ar...In Ipswich, Suffolk, the local Council and Plod are already limiting the sale of any beer or cider over 6.5%<br /><br />The Co-op is removing all such products across Suffolk!<br />Slippery slope anyone?<br />http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-suffolk-19700304treble9mannoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-72772509515980783382012-12-19T23:01:30.626+00:002012-12-19T23:01:30.626+00:00I have vague memories of reading a piece in Nottin...I have vague memories of reading a piece in <i>Nottingham Drinker</i> criticising the off-trade that could have come straight from the more hysterical wing of the anti-drink lobby.<br /><br />As if nobody's ever been obnoxious when pissed up on real ale.Curmudgeonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02558747878308766840noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-76491760640476994092012-12-19T22:48:42.434+00:002012-12-19T22:48:42.434+00:00I've just got back from Nottingham, where I ha...I've just got back from Nottingham, where I had a pretty foul pint of flabby, metallic-tasting beer while reading the local CAMRA magazine - which featured a column applauding the decision to bar a local offie from selling anything over 6.5%. The enemy is already within the gates, I fear. (Other odd features of the mag included what appeared to be a regular column contributed by the local police. I was glad to get back to <i>Opening Times</i>-land.)Philhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07009879034507926661noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-75122042786261455622012-12-19T18:35:51.683+00:002012-12-19T18:35:51.683+00:00“All the above arguments are equally stupid.”
Not...<i>“All the above arguments are equally stupid.”</i><br /><br />Not really, they’re just inaccurate (I guess because the people saying them wanted to exaggerate their point). But replace the word “tomorrow” with the word “eventually” and – hey presto – you’ve got an uncannily accurate description of what the PTB, under pressure from influential single-issue lobby groups, are inexorably moving towards, whether intentionally or not. That’s why it’s called a Slippery Slope, rather than a Cliff Edge.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-21927164980765941252012-12-19T18:24:27.494+00:002012-12-19T18:24:27.494+00:00Slippery slope arguments, as py0 notes should be g...Slippery slope arguments, as py0 notes should be given little credence and each case should be judged on its merits. <br /><br />It is far better to use the 'logical next step' argument as this avoids any of the issues associated with the 'slippery slope'.<br /><br />In the case of the two bars, if it is a success then the next logical step is to extend it, so the benefits can be had by all. <br /><br />All are had with the logical next step, no slippery slope, none at all.westcoast2https://www.blogger.com/profile/13832425628846431149noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-50205712902441505062012-12-19T16:44:32.802+00:002012-12-19T16:44:32.802+00:00Wot Cookie said @ 13:04. Glorious. :)Wot Cookie said @ 13:04. Glorious. :)Dick Puddlecotehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01481866882188932892noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-24264775853826419412012-12-19T16:31:25.754+00:002012-12-19T16:31:25.754+00:00How come, despite growing protests from both brewe...How come, despite growing protests from both brewers and consumers, we still stubbornly won't allow any UK breweries to sell non cask conditioned ale at any of our festivals then Nev? <br /><br />Actions speak louder than words.py0noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-74902567032590806312012-12-19T15:44:16.276+00:002012-12-19T15:44:16.276+00:00Re the "slippery slope", see this commen...Re the "slippery slope", see <a href="http://pubcurmudgeon.blogspot.co.uk/2012/06/hate-week-is-here.html?showComment=1339178980092#c5830931121524225299" rel="nofollow">this comment</a>.<br /><br /><i>"the phrase is widely and more generally used to mean something that sets a precedent for a principle to be extended, or encourages people to do so."</i><br /><br />If someone who supports both A and B says that A sets an example for doing B, which is somewhat similar, or that A proves that B can be done, then you have a slippery slope.<br /><br />Equally, if some pro-keg person was saying that, if we can get CAMRA to adopt keykeg, then it's only a matter of time before they support JS Extra Smooth, that would be a slippery slope. Curmudgeonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02558747878308766840noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-15970771188096847442012-12-19T15:30:38.783+00:002012-12-19T15:30:38.783+00:00You might have a point about CAMRA, PYO, if your s...You might have a point about CAMRA, PYO, if your summary of the campaign's view of beer other than real ale were true. It isn't.Neville Grundyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10923209266005338452noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-5902046117724894682012-12-19T13:49:42.016+00:002012-12-19T13:49:42.016+00:00* or indeed that favourite slippery slope argument...* or indeed that favourite slippery slope argument of CAMRA, "if we acknowledge that any beer other than CAMRA defined and approved cask conditioned real ale is any good at all, we might as well cease to exist altogether".py0noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-73044531104936457382012-12-19T13:46:42.287+00:002012-12-19T13:46:42.287+00:00They make for a neat piece of rabble-rousing rheto...They make for a neat piece of rabble-rousing rhetoric, but as a logical means of constructing an argument they have zero validity. You can basically use them to argue any stance you wish. <br /><br />If we legalise cannabis today, tomorrow heroin will be legalised.<br /><br />If we give women votes today, tomorrow domesticated animals will be allowed to vote.<br /><br />If we stop smokers from blowing carcinogens into other people's faces, tomorrow all forms of fun will be banned.<br /><br /><br />All the above arguments are equally stupid.py0noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-45977257164011234392012-12-19T13:27:47.853+00:002012-12-19T13:27:47.853+00:00"I don't give credence to slippery slope ...<i>"I don't give credence to slippery slope arguments"</i><br /><br />Nothing is inevitable, but if you blinkeredly refuse to accept that A ever sets a precedent for B or can be used as a template for it then you deserve to fail.Curmudgeonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02558747878308766840noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-3255770332404101952012-12-19T13:25:45.849+00:002012-12-19T13:25:45.849+00:00"No wonder you left, Mudge."
I stood do...<i>"No wonder you left, Mudge."</i><br /><br />I stood down from any official position. I am still a Life Member and have been known to attend the occasional event, plus contributing <a href="http://curmudgeoncolumns.blogspot.co.uk/" rel="nofollow">a monthly column to the local rag</a>.Curmudgeonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02558747878308766840noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-90918637947317921942012-12-19T13:23:14.779+00:002012-12-19T13:23:14.779+00:00FYI, a pint of Punk in a Brewdog bar was £3.80 las...FYI, a pint of Punk in a Brewdog bar was £3.80 last time I looked.<br /><br />I don't give credence to slippery slope arguments, simply debate the merits of each case on its own terms.py0noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-75217695547910123612012-12-19T13:14:59.735+00:002012-12-19T13:14:59.735+00:00I see from DP’s site that CAMRA, perhaps predictab...I see from DP’s site that CAMRA, perhaps predictably, are putting their goody-two-shoes hat on and supporting minimum pricing which, they say, will “help pubs.” Where have they been living for the last 20 years? Every CAMRA member should be sent a note saying in large letters: “45p MINIMUM PRICE – IT WON’T STOP THERE”, in case the Newcastle story hasn’t brought this stark realisation to their duped collective consciousness (which is likely, <i>n’est pas</i>?). One actually has to start to wonder if a few fifth-columnists haven’t been planted in their midst. No wonder you left, Mudge.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-12732320683174290332012-12-19T13:04:28.669+00:002012-12-19T13:04:28.669+00:00Still I find it heartwarming that responsible drin...Still I find it heartwarming that responsible drinking through price control affects not just the welfare poor, but those that supported it thinking it did not affect them.Cooking Lagerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02830924433230427226noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-33388181918586815232012-12-19T12:56:57.454+00:002012-12-19T12:56:57.454+00:00It would still make a pint of Punk IPA four quid, ...It would still make a pint of Punk IPA four quid, and I suspect they're not much above that.Curmudgeonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02558747878308766840noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-13405555876226554632012-12-19T12:49:15.187+00:002012-12-19T12:49:15.187+00:00If they do, given the names and the location, it&#...If they do, given the names and the location, it's probably of the "HOW MUCH a pint?" variety.<<<br /><br />Brewdog Newcastle is just down the hill... 'nuff said.ChrisMhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09088526990457894540noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-57963600210632131942012-12-19T12:15:38.790+00:002012-12-19T12:15:38.790+00:00Given that Sainsbury's don't have to sell ...Given that Sainsbury's don't <i>have</i> to sell strong beers (or indeed any beers at all) and this will be portrayed as a voluntary agreement, I doubt whether Belgian brewers would have much of a legal case. <br /><br />If, on the other hand, the council sought to prevent the sale of strong beers anywhere in their area then they would have a much better case for restraint of trade. In that case, I believe the council would be acting <i>ultra vires</i>. However, I feel that councils are seeking to extend their powers by small incremental steps.Curmudgeonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02558747878308766840noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-32675924039666872562012-12-19T12:00:17.189+00:002012-12-19T12:00:17.189+00:00Surely the Belgian beer producers can stop Perth a...Surely the Belgian beer producers can stop Perth and Kinross Council doing that?Jonathan Bagleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17331501151709216753noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-39602449157942733612012-12-19T11:58:32.405+00:002012-12-19T11:58:32.405+00:00If they do, given the names and the location, it&#...If they do, given the names and the location, it's probably of the "HOW MUCH a pint?" variety.<br /><br />But there are five Spoons within half a mile.Curmudgeonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02558747878308766840noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-22615917120156775502012-12-19T11:54:21.530+00:002012-12-19T11:54:21.530+00:00Oh I do hope these bars sell cask pong.Oh I do hope these bars sell cask pong.Cooking Lagerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02830924433230427226noreply@blogger.com