tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post7960312097638559474..comments2024-03-29T08:01:51.705+00:00Comments on The Pub Curmudgeon: Gone over to foodCurmudgeonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02558747878308766840noreply@blogger.comBlogger33125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-35452459684667095142017-07-28T07:50:17.078+01:002017-07-28T07:50:17.078+01:00In town centres, such as Stockport, Macclesfield a...In town centres, such as Stockport, Macclesfield and Stafford, micropubs and new-wave bars are closed on weekday lunchtimes while plenty of proper pubs nearby are open.Curmudgeonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02558747878308766840noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-21168177896348267822017-07-27T21:16:32.263+01:002017-07-27T21:16:32.263+01:00My experience of "traditional pubs" is t...My experience of "traditional pubs" is that the clientele tend to form cliques and that a shy retiring person like myself can find it very difficult to strike up a conversation. Whereas, as you say, in a micro pub you are often forced to join in the conversation. So nice choice: micropub when I feel like talking, trad when I want to sit and read.<br /><br />As for your criticism that micros have limited opening hours: many trad pubs don't open their doors until mid afternoon or, especially in the country, six or seven o'clock in the eveningdcbwhaleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02585310584555592882noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-18819425676297735682017-07-27T12:14:48.547+01:002017-07-27T12:14:48.547+01:00Not just eating out. In the modern economy consu...Not just eating out. In the modern economy consumers seem to want to screw the price of goods right down but are willing to spend silly sums on personal services. Seeking out a 0.1p reduction in the price of road fuel then splashing a tenner on having the car cleaned is typical example.dcbwhaleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02585310584555592882noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-28443074227120668282017-07-27T10:25:26.198+01:002017-07-27T10:25:26.198+01:00Its probably not actually the same customers thoug...Its probably not actually the same customers though. pynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-59546147131688119862017-07-26T21:39:19.671+01:002017-07-26T21:39:19.671+01:00An increase in eating out is one of the most notic...An increase in eating out is one of the most noticeable ways in which an increase in living standards is reflected - it is no longer an occasional treat but an everyday occurrence.Curmudgeonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02558747878308766840noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-36279570546336985292017-07-26T20:09:48.975+01:002017-07-26T20:09:48.975+01:00Quite apart from the argument about relative quali...Quite apart from the argument about relative quality of restaurants and pubs and gastropubs. I am always surprised just how large the market for pub food is. There seems to be an inherent contradiction between supermarkets squeezing there suppliers nearly out of business in order to reduce the average customers grocery bill by a couple of pounds and those same customers being willing to spend the thick end of a ton on a family meal out.<br /><br />Throughout my childhood and through most of my adult life eating out was a rare treat.dcbwhaleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02585310584555592882noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-21604045642378452882017-07-26T18:48:15.297+01:002017-07-26T18:48:15.297+01:00I wrote a post about the narrow appeal of micropub...I wrote a post about the narrow appeal of micropubs <a href="http://pubcurmudgeon.blogspot.co.uk/2017/04/micro-appeal.html" rel="nofollow">here</a>.Curmudgeonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02558747878308766840noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-83065717420460817652017-07-26T18:47:01.542+01:002017-07-26T18:47:01.542+01:00I am familiar with plenty of villages, thank you v...I am familiar with plenty of villages, thank you very much, but I struggle to think of any where the division between food-led and wet-led pub that you describe exists. I can think of at least two where it once did, but the wet-led pub has now closed.Curmudgeonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02558747878308766840noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-35533744077325149102017-07-26T17:36:26.409+01:002017-07-26T17:36:26.409+01:00It is interesting that a lot of the more modern, &...It is interesting that a lot of the more modern, 'craftier' places do indeed offer 'grab and go' pies, scotch eggs etc. (albeit typically of higher quality and at a higher price point)Ben Viveurhttp://www.benviveur.co.uknoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-61637511376380193112017-07-26T17:33:20.756+01:002017-07-26T17:33:20.756+01:00Why must micropubs have a 'very narrow appeal ...Why must micropubs have a 'very narrow appeal and customer base'? <br /><br />The one down here seems to attract a fairly diverse clientele. In terms of gender/class/age mix it's probably more diverse than the old backstreet wet-led working class boozer ever was. It wouldn't confirm the stereotypical view of Surrey either.<br /><br />If micropubs have a narrow appeal, then so do 'family-oriented food pubs'. And 'mainstream lager and sky sports pubs'. Indeed virtually every pub that isn't a Wetherspoons (which deliberately tries to offer something for everyone) has narrow appeal. That's the point. <br /><br />If there is a modern-day version of this 'everything for everybody' pub that may indeed never have really existed outside your own nostalgia, then it's a Spoons. And as the years go by, I find Spoons increasingly less and less attractive to me.Ben Viveurhttp://www.benviveur.co.uknoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-48415674585287457332017-07-26T11:02:42.313+01:002017-07-26T11:02:42.313+01:00A gastropub is a business model popularised in the...A gastropub is a business model popularised in the 1990s that uses the physical settings of a pub to host a relatively upscale restaurant. Nothing more or nothing less. A crap gastropub is still a gastropub, its just a crap one.pynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-34785731499767349302017-07-25T18:06:49.218+01:002017-07-25T18:06:49.218+01:00So, Py, your definition of a gastropub is made sol...So, Py, your definition of a gastropub is made solely by how much one charges? Interesting that most people, me included, would define a gastropub as a finer dining experience, irrespective of the cost. Good to see you're back on your usual form, by the way.<br /><br />Mudge, I think you'll find that behind the scenes, Brunning & Price are increasingly deviating enormously from the initial formula which was centred on food that was produced almost entirely from scratch in their own kitchens with their chefs given latitude over specials. Now, food is being sourced centrally and often just reheated in their kitchens.electricpicshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09144970068645280352noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-9768255275694054742017-07-25T14:51:13.031+01:002017-07-25T14:51:13.031+01:00Both of my nearest villages actually have 3 pubs -...Both of my nearest villages actually have 3 pubs - and we're talking about small villages with only a few hundred people.<br /><br />There must be hundreds of 2-pub villages near you. Do you have a car or a bike?pynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-23761545622416443272017-07-25T14:31:48.756+01:002017-07-25T14:31:48.756+01:00I'd like to know where these two-pub villages ...I'd like to know where these two-pub villages are where one is food-oriented and the other wet-led. In my experience, either one has closed down, and the remaining one is foody, or both are foody. Or both have closed down.Curmudgeonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02558747878308766840noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-79094733192183310572017-07-25T14:30:02.696+01:002017-07-25T14:30:02.696+01:00Yes, they are a chain, but it was originally set u...Yes, they are a chain, but it was originally set up as an independent business, and since the takeover they haven't deviated too far from the initial formula. If not a "gastropub" by some narrow, rarefied definition, they're certainly "high-end dining pubs". Curmudgeonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02558747878308766840noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-63757418767037713132017-07-25T13:44:49.664+01:002017-07-25T13:44:49.664+01:00Their main courses are around the £20 mark. I'...Their main courses are around the £20 mark. I'd love to know what your definition of a gastropub is if £20 for a main is considered small change. At what point does a pub become a gastropub up there in your rarefied air? £200 a head? £1000 a head?pynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-67941824095106051182017-07-25T08:41:00.983+01:002017-07-25T08:41:00.983+01:00Brunning and Price are a chain, owned by The Resta...Brunning and Price are a chain, owned by The Restaurant Group, owners of delights like Garfunkels and Frankie and Bennys. The food may be better than a Hungry Horse but most of it is higher end boil in the bag and ping. Not my idea of a gastropub. electricpicshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09144970068645280352noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-69508835595945749142017-07-25T07:01:31.368+01:002017-07-25T07:01:31.368+01:00That is something else which I regret. The passin...That is something else which I regret. The passing of ready to go food on the bar. When travelling with shortish time between trains or busses I want to be able to grab a pie instanta not wait half an hour for a sandwich to be dressed up on a plate with various varieties of grass.dcbwhaleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02585310584555592882noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-36453568844695969842017-07-24T22:44:28.323+01:002017-07-24T22:44:28.323+01:00Some of my happiest times in pubs were as a kid, e...Some of my happiest times in pubs were as a kid, eating food.<br />It can be done very badly, usually in a chain like spoons, toby carvery etc or a gastropub with 12 quid burgers and pretentious bollocks.<br />Wet pubs should do snacks better (no cooking needed).Kieran Lyonshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10309306469722070363noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-25710935210125343142017-07-24T18:41:53.721+01:002017-07-24T18:41:53.721+01:00This is by no means a solely rural phenomenon - it...This is by no means a solely rural phenomenon - it has now extended to many suburban areas too. <br /><br />And micropubs, with their very narrow appeal and customer base, are no substitute for proper all-round pubs where you'd see a wide variety of customers.Curmudgeonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02558747878308766840noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-23716647194573799502017-07-24T17:39:42.320+01:002017-07-24T17:39:42.320+01:00Keep the middle aged middle class real ale alkies ...Keep the middle aged middle class real ale alkies in the micro pub.<br /><br />Give me a microwave meal that comes with a pint in the company of screaming kids any day of the week.Cooking Lagerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02830924433230427226noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-13251142429416529972017-07-24T17:15:12.245+01:002017-07-24T17:15:12.245+01:00Well. If the definition of a gastropub is one tha...Well. If the definition of a gastropub is one that has table service then I have obviously been going to ordinary food led pubs. But that doesn't change my reservations about the standard of service.dcbwhaleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02585310584555592882noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-47466395562289078512017-07-24T16:56:06.136+01:002017-07-24T16:56:06.136+01:00Indeed, and markets segment. If a town or largish ...Indeed, and markets segment. If a town or largish village has two pubs, chances are one will go upmarket or family-friendly and focus on food, and the other on flogging copious amounts of cheap beer to the local young folk and alcoholics, sorry, I mean regulars. Variations on a theme.<br /><br />Which one will have good beer? Your guess is as good as mine.pynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-43439078787948703572017-07-24T16:03:16.207+01:002017-07-24T16:03:16.207+01:00Markets adapt. Pubs that were formerly wet-led mig...Markets adapt. Pubs that were formerly wet-led might have to shift the balance of their trade over to food in order to survive, but this creates a void which is increasingly being filled by the 'wetsclusive' micropub. <br /><br />I think we'll see a divergence between larger, more rural pubs with kitchens meeting one need (families and groups travelling by car, wanting to eat) and far smaller, generally urban pubs with lower overheads meeting another (the traditional beer drinker who will go for a curry or pick up a kebab after they've drunk sufficient).<br /><br />I'm not unhappy if the market continues to go this way, though I appreciate that people like Mudgie might be more bothered about not being able to drink in old pub buildings. I don't like the idea that the 'traditional country pub' doesn't really exist any more and is now effectively a restaurant, but this has been the direction of travel for a while, probably since drink-driving laws were introduced if we're honest.<br />Ben Viveurhttp://www.benviveur.co.uknoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5623537812609722663.post-68156096463597917622017-07-24T14:18:00.726+01:002017-07-24T14:18:00.726+01:00Every Brunning and Price I've ever been to has...Every Brunning and Price I've ever been to has had table service. Are you sure you're not thinking of fayre and square?pynoreply@blogger.com